1kid actually said the back end of what I didn't type. No, Kanye gets no medal/trophy from me for what he did, nor do I esteem him as some kind of superhero.

Our views are identical on this---he & what he said are but a very minute part of the total pie. But, I give him kudos because I believe (hope) that what he did will make some people that have been previously sleep, misinformed, or non chalant take a hard look at the BIG picture.

Truth is, America has long been fed up with the blatant deceit and bad judgement of the gov't and has been fighting for change long before Mr. West's speech, so he gets NO credit for that. He's just now voicing what America has been saying for a while. He just used Katrina as a platform to do so.

I guess registration isn't the only "late" thing about him...

"I just hope that all of this talk is backed up by some positive action, because all talk and no action is kinda like a car with no wheels----it' doesn't go very far..."

it will be.
for a few months
and then nothing..
flatline.
people feel motivated right now to make changes and help out.
when the hype dies down, so will the activism.
not everyone, but most. it's all good. mad love to those that put forth any effort. every little bit counts, but think how dope it'd be if we all did something.
don't get me started. i can start to sound like a crazy lunatic afterawhile, so i'll let it go.....not yet.

i just don't get how people feel it's NOT their responsibility to help the next man/woman, when i'm pretty sure someone helped them or their parents, grandparents at some point in life.

back to discussion...cool kayne - do your thing kid. now, how about giving me a few G's for my HIV program that help the poor (you know those that were poor before katrina and are still poor after)? (i write that in a laughing, sarcastic manner, it's all good)

kaedeepee, true, but I think there is more talk about change in this country at the moment because of the debacle of the Iraq War, gas prices (let's face it...rich white dudes have to PAY for gas...they don't get that for free) and the fall-out from the governments reaction to / treatment of the victims of Hurricane Katrina. I wouldn't be giving Kanye a medal for making America think about change through his comments. He's a small part of a much bigger pie.

...We now return you to our normally scheduled program...And now, back to the Kanye West discussion...

Let's face it...Kanye spoke the sentiments of many Americans (and non-Americans). I personally think that the timing was right, but the place/forum/platform was terribly wrong. Kanye took the focus off of the people that REALLY needed it and shifted it to himself. There's probably no way of knowing how many people saw his antics and changed their minds about contributing to the cause, neither do I believe that his "speech" brought in significant extra dollars for the flood victims. I heard his "speech" and although what he said didn't prevent my contribution, it didn't exactly inspire me to give more (even though what he said was true)...I agree, his timing seems a little coincidental.

I know that he wanted to speak his mind to as broad of an audience as possible, and chances are that his full unscripted commentary wouldn't have knowingly aired on any other TV show, but consider this:

Kanye is a multi-platinum selling artist. That means that every platinum tier reached represents AT LEAST a million people that agree with what he says & does. If he needed an audience, he could've put that $#!% on a record and reached tens of millions!

I don't recall NWA ever crashing an UNCF telethon to say, "F**k The Police" to the masses and speak out against the corruption of law enforcement. I don't recall Ice-T ever crashing a NAACP telethon to voice his dislike with the enforcement of freedom of speech and the 1st Admendment. They put it on wax, we bought it, and we agreed.

If there's any good to come from this, it's the fact that Kanye's gotten people to start doing something that most haven't done----talk about change. I just hope that all of this talk is backed up by some positive action, because all talk and no action is kinda like a car with no wheels----it' doesn't go very far...

The greatest holocust known to man??? Africans are probably up there, butthis country was full of native american tribes when europeans arrived - look at the size of America and look up how few native tribes are left... If you're going to compare holocosts in terms of world history, you've got to look at the entire world and it's entire "known" history.
Sorry for writing so much last time.. I got carried away.

“Fact is, the white youth of this country still benefits from the sins of their father, spanning multiple generations. The black youth of this country still suffers from the sins of your fathers too.” (Not all of them, tho)

that division is exactly what they want from us my man. Point blank. (werd!)

I love political and historical discourse…
I pulled these comments because I agree with both of them.
The "facts" of history are, America was founded on the premise of white superiority by a group of European elites who wanted to keep the money they were making and the British crown was taxing. They accomplished this by convincing the colonies’ farmers, indentured servants (mainly poor and white) and free blacks that they were fighting for “freedom” and “democracy” [Do any of these tactics sound familiar?] The war was won, the country was born, the rich got richer the poor got poorer – and some in the middle ascended and a middle class was born.

In order to quell any revolutionary ideas within the newly formed country poor whites and blacks were discouraged from associating with each other, which they had done then & as we do now. Native tribes were also villainized and perceived as less human.

During the civil war the Irish were pit against blacks, during the early labor movement Italian Immigrants were pit against Jews, Polish, Blacks, etc. The theory behind American policy is to divide and control. Those who beat the system – so to speak – assimilate into the mainstream in order to maintain their hard won standard of living.

Now that the “Hispanic” population in the US has surpassed blacks, the government has been wooing more and more Latino leaders – who are predominantly light skinned. The FBI classifies Hispanic as an ethnicity and thus divides them into black/Hispanic & white/Hispanic. Asians have their own hierarchy of superiority with Cambodians, Vietnamese, and Indo-Chinese (darker skinned ppl) at the bottom.

Disunity and chaos will maintain the status quo – as long as the govt. can point to an enemy; i.e the Soviet Union, Black Panther Party, KKK, Osama/Al Qaeda, illegal immigrants, it has an excuse to spend our tax $$$ on “defense” “security” and slowly diminish our freedoms guaranteed under the constitution. Blacks are just one of the groups in America that got a bad deal – however U and “your” people are divided amongst themselves.

The biggest opportunity ever missed for blacks in America to flex was the gap that formed between the civil rights movement and hip-hop – imagine the power the two generations might have wielded.

Truer words were never spoken. It is quite embarrassing for me to see the majority of white Americans aghast by what's happened in New Orleans. It's as it they're all saying "there are still poor people in this country??," "there were black people in New Orleans,"...very, very embarrassing.

i give him credit for speaking his mind.

but this fight about poverty, race, etc. isn't new. if it took a "celebrity" to bring it to light for some people, that's a **** shame.

talk is overrated.
getting off your *** and actually doing something - that's where my focus is.

didn't take a "celebrity" to realize that.

please....

x, thanks for the nod on the other thread to and believe me I more than respect your opinion as well. I can't defend those who do not know about the Middle Passage and Jim Crow laws, but I still have to beg to differ that my family has benefitted (but maybe we'll just agree to disagree there too). Like they say, walk a mile in someone else's shoes. Hurdles pop up for everyone and whether you feel they're insignificant, my relatives had to struggle to get my family to the point where we are now. That's not to say that I know anything about your family. I actually don't. And your ancestors for that matter. Like you said it's not really about comparing historical events, but I just find as an avid student of history (and I mean real history not "his story") sometimes emotions get in the way when people talk about this stuff and accusatory tones and allegations just impede progress.

Funny enough I had an in-depth conversation with Donnie about Jim Crow laws at his private performance / listening party for 'The Colored Section' in an upscale loft in Manhattan a few years ago. Matter of fact there were a few GS Members from these Forums in on that conversation. There were tears, hugs and understanding like I've rarely experienced before or since. Would love to link up with you more to talk about this more in depth, so definitely give me a shout if you're ever in Baltimore or NYC.

I definitely agree with what Kanye said. I mean it's kind of apparent that the government as a whole gives little care to the poor in this country (who are disproportionally (sp?) black). I think people were just shocked and confused at the timing of his comments. But hey, it's been said and it's definitely made an impact because we're all still talking about it!

Your parents didn't have to be here for 200 years. Your ancestors didn't have to own slaves..but they benefitted from the Jim Crow laws just the same. Now that's where you show YOUR ignorance.

I'd already conceded that others participated in the civil rights movements. Some even lost their lives, but very few lost all of their land, all of their business, had homes burned to a crisp, were lynched or had substandard services and products on account of their white skin.


Your immigrant ancestors on account of its white skin enjoyed rights and privileges that not even blacks born and raised in this country had. So, the timing of their entrance matters not. So yes, whether you care to believe it or chose to gloss over it...your Polish and Irish immigrants grandparents are just as guilty as the rest. They participated and reinforced Jim Crow laws too. So what exactly did your people do for my benefit?

>3,000,000 (count the zeros) NON-Jewish Poles were >systematically wiped out during the Holocaust.
> A fact that you rarely hear about when that >horrible era of history is discussed. Don't even get >me started on the treatment of Irish immigrants in >this country.

This is the part I laugh at. Have you ever read anything about the middle passage? You talk about 3 million lives. The bones of that many Africans lay on the bed of the Atlantic Ocean. Now that's a fact that you RARELY hear about when that horrible era of history is discussed. And that's just a number of those that never made it to America.

But this isn't really about comparing your history to mine because it doesn't compare. Black people in America and abroad have suffered the greatest holocaust known to modern man. That quite frankly isn't debatable.

We'll just have to agree to disagree. But to get back to the original topic. I'm glad Kanye said what he said when he said because obviously too many folk are walking around with blinders on their eyes and ipods in their ears.